Toribash
Absolutely loving the Druid C'thun Ramp deck. So versatile, great tempo, great end game.

Loving Hearthstone again. Contemplating disenchanting my wild cards.
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Creati0n says: still my favorite. <3
I sacrificed my firstborn for this great human being to join (M) ~R
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Originally Posted by RAWWRH View Post
I use to throw down in yugioh as a kid. I justify spending money onow free games based on how much time I spend in a game. So if I sink 30 hours in I'll throw $20 at it.

General terminology, deck building. Any basic info. I set up a Shamen deck which I'm having moderate success with. But I cant acknowledge my mistakes.


The headache with teaching you all this will be less stressful than League, but yeah I'll go for it.


@Oracle: You don't see the C'thun decks as a positive thing? The 2 mana 2/3 add +2/+2 to C'thun is too slow for most decks, the 3/5 Taunt is definitely too slow, the 3 mana 2/1 deal +2 obviously is an okay card but easily disposed of. The 4 mana 4/2 divine shield however is a fantastic card, that I'll agree with. And yeah Dark Arrokoa is fantastic.

C'thun decks are a fantastic way to teach new players about slower play, tempo, and curving out decks. It's a F2P alternative for sure. The less you want to spend on this game, usually you have to use very boring fast decks like Face Hunter. Now - face isn't always the place.
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Creati0n says: still my favorite. <3
I sacrificed my firstborn for this great human being to join (M) ~R
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Originally Posted by RAWWRH View Post
I still hold the information you taught me while playing league.

If you want, RAWWRH#1162


I'll add you now, and maybe we can get on skype at some point.
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Creati0n says: still my favorite. <3
I sacrificed my firstborn for this great human being to join (M) ~R
Just Use Thunder!
Originally Posted by Oracle View Post
Except C'thun Druid has essentially become the new Secret Paladin of the perfect curve deck.

Turn 2: 2/3, +2/+2 to C'thun
Turn 3: 2/1, 2 damage, +2/+2 to C'thun
Turn 4: Klaxi Weaver, 4/10 body
Turn 5: Face Cat, 4/4 charge, OR Taunt Bear, 4/6 taunt
Turn 6: Dark Arakkoa, +3/+3 to C'thun, 5/7 taunt
Turn 7: Twin Emperor, 2 4/6 taunts.
Turn 8: Why the fuck haven't you conceded yet?

C'thun Priest can stall the living shit out of any game, combined with all of the high defensive stats playing right into their hands for easy board trades and maintaining tempo.

C'thun Warrior is just obnoxious because of aforementioned stalling out the kazoo, except with an even better backup plan of fatigue to victory.


I have no problem with slower decks or slower metas, I think N'Zoth Paladin is a perfectly acceptable slow deck that's also competitively viable. The problem is that C'thun decks play like midrange or tempo, but have a control/combo end game. It essentially took the weakness of midrange and tempo, control matchups that survive their pressure and just exhaust their resources, and threw it out the window. And since midrange and tempo have better tools for dealing with early aggression compared to control decks, essentially C'thun decks have the safest overall matchups.


Most professional players agree - if a card doesn't have good enough stats to be played without the buffing of C'thun, it's not to be put into a C'thun deck.

Beckoner of Evil is too slow to play in most decks, or there are at least better choices.

Disciple of C'thun works well only with decks that prefer dealing damage immediately rather than getting a body on the board. Example being rogue. Twilight Elder is just a much better body for the mana cost.

Klaxxi - well I mean, we're no strangers to 4 mana minions with 4 attack and huge health pools. The condition that needs to be met to play it is however more conditional than dropping a twilight drake (Though in fairness, twilight drake is much weaker to silence than Klaxxi)

Dark Arakkoa - Great card, no argument there.

Twin Emperor - Better card than C'thun himself, no argument there.

C'thun - yeah.


That being said Druids did need quite a bit of love to stay relevant since their number #1 win condition was nerfed to the ground (FoN + SR), and on top of that they nerfed Ancient of Lore AND Keeper of the Grove to the point they aren't playable.



Warriors lost Death's Bite and Shieldbearer, and they'd rather have Death's Bite than this new 6/6 give yourself 10 armor if C'thun has been buffed. Control Warrior has too many staple cards to fit in C'thun buff cards. Which means if you want to run C'thun Warrior it's forced to be a fatigue deck, which tend to be very weak against combo decks.

Priest they have a million ways to gain health back but at least they can't overheal like Warrior. With as many big finishers like N'Zoth Paladin (as you mentioned), they can go from 30 to 0 very quick, and it's not like they have light bomb anymore.



I don't think C'thun decks are the safest by any stretch, I just think they are, like you said, easy to pilot. Again, much like Secret Paladin. There's something to be said about how much easier it is to play around a deck archetype when you know exactly what's coming and on what turn. And Shaman is just so damn fast now that people are playing that class now more than they ever had, which just so happens to punish greedy cards like BoE.
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Creati0n says: still my favorite. <3
I sacrificed my firstborn for this great human being to join (M) ~R
Just Use Thunder!
Kripparian just made one of the most insane aggro deck i've ever seen. This aggro murloc paladin deck is one of the best things that happend to me in 3 years of Heartstone. I wasn't expecting to go 6-0 in less than 10-15 minutes. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Mwr_OXLrbU

I haven't encountered board clears like Flamestrike or Brawl, but i faced a Lightning Strike from Shaman it was such a useless removal for this insane murloc unleash.
Originally Posted by Oracle View Post
A great well thought out post but I don't want to make this post huge so I'm cutting it.


What rank are you playing at and what decks are you running? I have a hard time seeing what problems you're running into that C'thun Druid is giving you such a hard time.

Fundamentally, I'm in favor of a few easy to pilot archetypes for the sole purpose of I want casual players to understand and enjoy Hearthstone. I'm even happier that this particular archetype isn't (for me) as annoying to deal with as face decks and pure aggro. I can remember a time not too long ago when 2 out of every 3 decks I was running into was mech mage or undertaker hunter, where if they had an okay start it was very difficult to win, and if they had a dream start - forget about it, you lost.

If C'thun Druid in particular becomes the meta deck everyone's rocking, I can at least tech cards into existing decks, rather than frustratingly switch decks to a hard counter. It goes without saying that Slyvannas Windrunner is an unbelievable card to play against all C'thun Decks (yes I know, you can Entomb it if it's C'thun Priest). The Black Knight is another card that's fantastic to run against C'thun Druid, since they don't run as much removal as they used to and an on curbe TBK after they drop their big 6 mana C'thun taunt is game changing. If you get them to swipe hero power one minion by itself, that's a huge win. Certainly the new Warlock Zoo, Midrange and Face Shaman (also Darwin Shaman), Beast Hunter that runs Freezing Trap, N'Zoth Priest, etc. all do pretty damn well against it. Even deathrattle rogue is looking very solid ATM.

I will say though Priest is in a very difficult spot right now playing against C'thun Decks, especially C'thun Druid. Twin Emperor is a BITCH to handle as priest, as is Klaxxi.
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Creati0n says: still my favorite. <3
I sacrificed my firstborn for this great human being to join (M) ~R
Just Use Thunder!
I'm starting to play this game again and I have to say, C'Thun is just ridiculous. I can be winning by far, then a barely buffed C'Thun lands on the board and just clears it. I have literally never had a game since I started that I won when C'Thun got on the board. This is partially due to the fact that I don't leave any cards in hand to clear (most of the time I can't spare any anyways) but either way I lose on the very turn they summon C'Thun. Even if he wasn't a huge minion, his battlecry destroys my board, 100% of the time. I haven't a clue how to counter this.
FIRED UP
Wowowow!

Just started laddering with Zoolock, insane deck. Very very high win rate against shaman which is the class I see most often. Usually is an auto-concede against Priest/Patron Warrior. Very good match-up against Rogue (only lose if he has an insane start with multiple backstabs n such and I have a bad start). Probably 45-55 against Druid, depends on what type. And I'm 65-35 against aggro paladin, and 35-65 against N'zoth stalladin.

I think the most important thing about using Zoo for laddering is the game length. I know whether or not I've won by turn 5 90% of the time, meaning I'll just drop a concede quickly and move forward to the next game, or just finish them in the upcoming turns. I've even conceded as early as turn 3 because I understood the situation. This makes for an extremely low average game length, perfect for the monotony of ladder climbing. My favorite class is Warrior, and I'll often pilot those decks for 9 minutes a game, which if either way I rock around 55% win percent, I'd much prefer playing 40 games a day to 12 for laddering.

1 star away from Rank 7. I MAY go for legendary this season, don't know.
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Creati0n says: still my favorite. <3
I sacrificed my firstborn for this great human being to join (M) ~R
Just Use Thunder!
Originally Posted by RAWWRH View Post
I'm just over here trying to learn how to play the game. I've won ~ 40 games so far. Trying to craft a deck to try, should be good.

Can anyone explain tempo and mana curve? Is tempo just you consistency with playing cards and making moves?

Is mana curve just the average cost in your deck?


I gotchu fam.

Tempo is what you're able to do to keep the game moving forward in a positive direction for you. For instance, trading a 2/3 into a 4/2 minion, killing it, then summoning your own 5/5 minion would be tempo. Summoning a doomsayer against an empty board because you know they are Zoo and want to buy yourself a turn, that'd be a SLOW tempo play. If you have 7 mana as a mage, and your choices are to summon a large minion, or cast flame strike, summoning the large minion (while not necessarily the right thing to do) would be the tempo play, whereas casting flamestrike would be a control play.

Mana curve isn't so much "average" cost of your deck, but rather how many cards you have in each mana cost. Example, if you have a low mana curve, usually you have mostly 1,2,3 drops and a sprinkled in 4 5 drop here and there. A mid range mana curve usually places an emphasis on 4 drops. A "timmy" deck may have multiple cards that are 7+ mana. It's not so much about averages so much as it is about when do you plan to play what you have.
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Creati0n says: still my favorite. <3
I sacrificed my firstborn for this great human being to join (M) ~R
Just Use Thunder!
Okay haven't visited this thread in a while, but since the meta has slightly settled I'm gonna post my thoughts here.

Top 3 decks atm imo -

1. Zoo
2. Aggro Shaman
3. N'Zoth Pally

Miracle rogue is a close 4th, and really Zoo and Aggro Shaman are basically tied, but I went with Zoo as #1 because it's more flexible.

I've been playing mostly N'Zoth Pally and so far here are the matchup odds imo:

Zoo - 55% - 40% Pally favored. If you catch one of their councilmen or sea giants in a Wild Pyro/Equality clear you basically win.

Aggro Shaman - 50% - 50% It basically comes down to if Shaman has coin totem golem or trogg into feral spirits vs if the pally has pyro equality.

Any control - 60% - 40% pally favored. Any C'thun or general control like Control warrior or renolock gets absolutely shit on by this deck. They can't keep up with how many things they have to remove over the course of the game, and you win in fatigue when you heal for 40 with forbidden healing.

Miracle - 60% - 40% miracle favored. Obviously miracle is a control counter, as it has always been. Can't keep up with the tempo. Most times you win is when you can kill the auctioneers before they have a full draw turn.

I would recommend the deck. I haven't been seeing too many Miracle rogues, and there is a ton of zoo and random control decks that people are trying.